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Post by vintagecomics on Jan 27, 2022 7:03:12 GMT -8
@prince Namor
Before I go into answering all of these questions, can I ask you one question?
Do you believe there was an intentional coverup or obfuscation of the investigation into the lab leak theory by Peter Daszak and/or possible parties involved with him?
I'm asking because it's relevant to the entire discussion.
I can only think of 3 possible answers:
1) Yes
2) No
3) You don't know
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Post by vintagecomics on Jan 27, 2022 15:16:22 GMT -8
Here is a great example of media gaslighting.
This journalist busts the CBC news crew filming a small crowd and avoiding filming the large crowd, misrepresenting public support of the Freedom Convoy driving across Canada.
For those that don't know, the CBC is a government subsidized news organization and over the last 2 years of the pandemic has been accused often of misrepresenting the news.
This is also a great video questioning why there is a media blackout on the Freedom Convoy. I am having a lot of trouble finding any significant pictures of videos of the convoy on mainstream news.
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Post by Prince Namor on Jan 28, 2022 5:03:33 GMT -8
@prince Namor
Before I go into answering all of these questions, can I ask you one question?
Do you believe there was an intentional coverup or obfuscation of the investigation into the lab leak theory by Peter Daszak and/or possible parties involved with him?
I'm asking because it's relevant to the entire discussion.
I can only think of 3 possible answers:
1) Yes
2) No
3) You don't know
I don't know. We may never know. Did Lee Harvey Oswald act alone? We may never know for sure. People can show me this and show me that, and I can even formulate an opinion on it, but... ultimately correlation does not imply causation. |
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Post by Prince Namor on Jan 28, 2022 5:13:19 GMT -8
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Post by vintagecomics on Jan 28, 2022 6:33:39 GMT -8
Thanks, Sherlock. I wish I'd thought of that.  Me and my friends HAVE been searching the internet and here in Canada, you find articles with the odd picture here or there but nothing substantial.
Like, if this convoy IS actually over 40 miles long, you'd see a long streaming video showing it but the MSM only shows little clips or outtakes just like that UK article above, which has simply taken clips and snippets from many different Canadian news sites and lumped them all into one article.
And up until the last two days, there was literally NOTHING on the news except for a few little misinformation campaigns.
Kind of odd considering this has been in the works for a week now and is looking to be the largest protest Canada has seen.
Almost every single bridge in my area (Southern Ontario) had 100's of people and possibly 1000'son each bridge in some areas encouraging truckers and almost nobody is showing that information or the scope of how great the public support is, either.
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parker1865
TCBF Member
Joined: September 2018
Posts: 1,325
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Post by parker1865 on Jan 28, 2022 10:25:08 GMT -8
Sheldon II in the making. And to think we are present for the Birth and will be able to say "I was there when...).
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Post by vintagecomics on Jan 28, 2022 18:28:45 GMT -8
@prince Namor
Before I go into answering all of these questions, can I ask you one question?
Do you believe there was an intentional coverup or obfuscation of the investigation into the lab leak theory by Peter Daszak and/or possible parties involved with him?
I'm asking because it's relevant to the entire discussion.
I can only think of 3 possible answers:
1) Yes
2) No
3) You don't know
I don't know. We may never know. Did Lee Harvey Oswald act alone? We may never know for sure. People can show me this and show me that, and I can even formulate an opinion on it, but... ultimately correlation does not imply causation.
Well, let me share with you some of what I know.
There is a trail of breadcrumbs a mile long with much more evidence than the LHO theory, and a smoking gun that is hard to unsee.
Sorry it took so long to respond but this is a very long story with a lot of twists and turns.
I'd be interested to know what you think after reading this - I tried to prove supporting links where I felt necessary, but you can ask for sources if you need them. Pretty much all of this is able to be corroborated pretty easily.
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- September 2019 - US intelligence gathers evidence that several Wuhan Institute of Virology Employees are checked into hospital with flu like symptoms
- Sept-October 2019 - China almost completely empties Wuhan for Military World Games - buildings have all floors up to 11th floor emptied, all signalling and digital signs are taken down or disabled and Wuhan is a ghost town when athletes arrive
- Oct 18-27 2019 - nearly 10,000 athletes from 100 countries from all over the world show up in Wuhan for the games
- Oct 29 2019 on - athletes fly home from Wuhan. A significant number of Canadian athletes contract strong flu like symptoms and end up quarantining in one part of the plane on the way home. American athletes and atheletes from around the world corroborated the same story
- Dec 8-9 2019 - Peter Daszak conducts an interview at a virology convention in Singapore called TWIV stating how co-operative the Chinese are in viral research and also explains how easy it is to do "Gain Of Function" research at the WIV
The interview can be found on YouTube under the name of - TWiV 615: Peter Daszak of EcoHealth Alliance
Daszak talks about coronavirus research at the 28 minute mark.
"Coronavirus is a pretty good..you know all this. You can manipulte them in the lab pretty easily. Spike protein drives a lot of what happens with coronavirus. Zoonotic risk. You can get the sequence. You can get the protein. And we work with Ralph Barricc at UNC to do this. Insert into the backbone of another virus and do some work in the lab."
- Jan 31 2020 - Fauci receives email from NIH scientist stating that the virus looks like it was engineerd in a lab - this email was discovered after Faucis emails were shown publicly over a year later
- Jan-Feb 2020 - news of the pandemic breaks to the world and various lockdown measures are taken
- Feb - March 2020 - Peter Daszak pens a letter to the Lancet callled "Statement in support of the scientists" to tell the science world to "strongly condemn conspiracy theories suggesting that COVID-19 does not have a natural origin." and it's signed on by 26 of this collegues
www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext
- Mar 2020 - the world shuts down based on a modelling report by Neil Ferguson
- April 2020 - Facebook / Twitter / YouTube start censoring ANY discussion of lab leak theory based on guidance from Fauci - townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2021/06/02/we-now-know-why-facebook-may-have-censored-the-lab-leak-theory-n2590360
But now a newly surfaced email from CEO Mark Zuckerberg, which was obtained through a Freedom of Information Act request from Buzzfeed, may explain why Facebook was censoring the information.
"Tony: I wanted to send a note of thanks for your leadership and everything you're doing to make our country's response to this outbreak as effective as possible. I also wanted to share a few ideas of ways we could help you get your message out but I understand you're incredibly busy, so don't feel a need to reply unless these seem interesting," Zuckerberg wrote in an email to Fauci on March 15, 2020, adding that he wanted to help get "authoritative" information out to the masses.
Fauci responded to Zuckerberg directly and worked with him on a number of messaging projects for the platform.
When Fauci was asked about the lab leak theory in April 2020, he downplayed the idea. Facebook then started removing posts and conversations about the lab leak theory from their platform.
"Could you address these suggestions or concerns that this virus was somehow manmade, possibly came out of a laboratory in China?" Fauci was asked by a reporter during an official White House Coronavirus Taskforce briefing.
"The mutations that it took to get to the point where it is now is totally consistent with a jump of a species from an animal to a human," Fauci said.
- April / May / June 2020 - scientists start asking why nobody is investigating the lab leak theory. Bret Weinstein, Alina Chan of MIT, Phillipa Lentjos and many other scientists start publicly asking why nobody is investigating the lab leak theory and why the science is shunnign any discussion of it.
They start to publicly discuss how the virus acts like it was bred indoors since it seems to live and move well indoors but not outdoors at all.
Brett Weinstein states "It's as if there is some massive gravitational pull, pulling ANY discuss of the possiblity of a lab leak out of the public discussion"
- Sept 2020 - Boston Magazine publshed a detailed article entitled "Could Covid-19 Have Escaped From A Lab?" and the sub title states "The world’s preeminent scientists say a theory from the Broad Institute’s Alina Chan is too wild to be believed. But when the theory is about the possibility of COVID being man-made, is this science or censorship?"
Alina Chan is a Canadian molecular biologist specializing in gene therapy and cell engineering at the Broad Institute of MIT and Harvard, where she is a postdoctoral fellow.
www.bostonmagazine.com/news/2020/09/09/alina-chan-broad-institute-coronavirus/
The article goes into detail on how Peter Daszak tries to obfuscate the lab leak discussion by condemning Alina Chan's work on the biological and genomic study into the origins of the virus.
It's important to note that Alina Chan has openly challenged ANYONE to debate her on the lab leak theory
- Feb 2021 WHO investigation into Wuhan has Peter Daszak as the only American on the team. Scientists from around the world scream 'bloody murder' as Daszak poses a clear conflict of interest in the investigation, considering he was involved in research at the WIV on Coronaviruses.
Daszak's statement after the investigation concludes that the virus was likely of zoonotic origin and either came from a mystery animal or frozen foods.
- March / April 2021 - Jamie Metzl and a group of 25 other scientists pen an open letter looking for a proper investigation into the lab leak theory that is 'truly independant' citing concerns of conflict of interest and the fact that half the researches were Chinese.
What most people DO NOT REALIZE is that China only agreed to the WHO investigation led by Daszak if they had final VETO over their findings and what they were allowed to release.
Jamie's open letter gets published in several prominent national news papers.
s.wsj.net/public/resources/documents/COVID%20OPEN%20LETTER%20FINAL%20030421%20(1).pdf
- July 5, 2021 - a group of scientists call out for a proper investigation into the lab leak theory in The Lancet and decry Daszak's involvement and earlier Feb 2020 condemnation of the investigation into the lab leak
A Correspondence was published in The Lancet called “Science, not speculation, is essential to determine how SARS-CoV-2 reached humans”. The letter recapitulates the arguments of an earlier letter (published in February, 2020) by the same authors, which claimed overwhelming support for the hypothesis that the novel coronavirus causing the COVID-19 pandemic originated in wildlife. The authors associated any alternative view with conspiracy theories by stating: “We stand together to strongly condemn conspiracy theories suggesting that COVID-19 does not have a natural origin”. The statement has imparted a silencing effect on the wider scientific debate, including among science journalists
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"Scientific journals should open their columns to in-depth analyses of all hypotheses. As scientists, we need to evaluate all hypotheses on a rational basis, and to weigh their likelihood based on facts and evidence, devoid of speculation concerning possible political impacts.
Contrary to the first letter published in The Lancet by Calisher and colleagues, we do not think that scientists should promote “unity” (“We support the call from the Director-General of WHO to promote scientific evidence and unity over misinformation and conjecture”). As shown above, research-related hypotheses are not misinformation and conjecture. More importantly, science embraces alternative hypotheses, contradictory arguments, verification, refutability, and controversy. Departing from this principle risks establishing dogmas, abandoning the essence of science, and, even worse, paving the way for conspiracy theories. Instead, the scientific community should bring this debate to a place where it belongs: the columns of scientific journals."
- September 2021 - 1.5 years later, the scientific community brings a scathing letter to the Lancet arguing that the original Lancet letter penned by Daszak obfuscated and suppressed the scientific investigation into the origins of the pandemic.
www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)02019-5/fulltext#%20
"The authors associated any alternative view with conspiracy theories by stating: “We stand together to strongly condemn conspiracy theories suggesting that COVID-19 does not have a natural origin”. The statement has imparted a silencing effect on the wider scientific debate, including among science journalists."
- Oct 5 2021 - Francis Collins announces he's stepping down as director of NIH
That's enough to give you the gist of what I know.
There is far more evidence. I'm not sure how deep you want to dig?
For example
a) the WIV was COMPLETELY renovated in the past year since after the pandemic started
b) there are missing genome sequences of coronaviruses from the WIV data
c) there is missing research papers that have been removed from the WIV d) not all genetic sequences that they work on have been uploaded e) the wet market was completely scrubbed and no traces of Coronavirus were ever found there
f) it works in China's favor to not investigate the lab leak theory properly g) after over 2 years, there is STILL NOT ONE SHRED OF EVIDENCE LINKING AN ANIMAL TO ZOONOTIC ORIGIN even though MERS and SARS were found in 4-9 months
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Now, looking in hindsight at your post of what US intelligence agencies concluded which was this:
"According to an unclassified summary, four members of the U.S. intelligence community say with low confidence that the virus was initially transmitted from an animal to a human. A fifth intelligence agency believes with moderate confidence that the first human infection was linked to a lab. Analysts do not believe the virus was developed as a bioweapon and most agencies believe the virus was not genetically engineered"
So if they say it was with 'low confidence' that it was transmitted from an animal to a human does that mean there is higher confidence that it was a lab leak?
And if they state that a "fifth intelligence agency believes with moderate confidence that the first human infection was linked to a lab" does that not confirm the 1st sentance?
Now, reading all of this, can you agree with me that this looks like a coverup?
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Post by Prince Namor on Jan 31, 2022 7:41:40 GMT -8
Lets' start with:
WHO is it that you think wants to 'cover it up'?
WHY do they want to 'cover it up'?
WHAT do they gain from it?
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parker1865
TCBF Member
Joined: September 2018
Posts: 1,325
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Post by parker1865 on Jan 31, 2022 7:55:41 GMT -8
Deflection is the Identification Badge of Sheldonism.
Hercule' Poirot was also fictional.
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Post by vintagecomics on Jan 31, 2022 15:04:21 GMT -8
Lets' start with: WHO is it that you think wants to 'cover it up'? WHY do they want to 'cover it up'? WHAT do they gain from it? None of those matter. It's all obfuscation of what is germane. This is a conversation between me and you. The facts are laid out clearly and the evidence unequivocal.
I've shared this more than once, but this article from Vanity Fair is probably one of the best I've ever read on the topic and it will tie all the above that I wrote together. It even sheds a little light on the questions you just asked.
I'm asking you the same question again, does this look like a cover up to you?
a) Yes
b) No
c) I don't know
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Post by Prince Namor on Jan 31, 2022 20:18:41 GMT -8
Lets' start with: WHO is it that you think wants to 'cover it up'? WHY do they want to 'cover it up'? WHAT do they gain from it? None of those matter. Wrong answer.It's all obfuscation of what is germane.
I could say that about some of what YOU have put forth.
This is a conversation between me and you. The facts are laid out clearly and the evidence unequivocal.
Not hardly. People who claim cough syrup cure Co-Vid19 keep muddying the waters.
I've shared this more than once, but this article from Vanity Fair is probably one of the best I've ever read on the topic and it will tie all the above that I wrote together. It even sheds a little light on the questions you just asked.
The Lab-Leak Theory: Inside the Fight to Uncover COVID-19’s Origins
And it's conclusion is we still don't know - certainly nothing is 'unequivocal' - and we may never know.
It IS, however a very well done article and lends more credibility to your quest than anything you've put forth so far.
You may want to use it as a guiding light, because some of the other quacks you quote, don't help your cause any.
I'm asking you the same question again, does this look like a cover up to you?
a) Yes
b) No
c) I don't know
A Magician sawing a woman in half LOOKS like someone getting sawed in half - doesn't mean it is.
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Post by vintagecomics on Jan 31, 2022 21:07:43 GMT -8
None of those matter. Wrong answer.It's all obfuscation of what is germane.
I could say that about some of what YOU have put forth.
This is a conversation between me and you. The facts are laid out clearly and the evidence unequivocal.
Not hardly. People who claim cough syrup cure Co-Vid19 keep muddying the waters.
I've shared this more than once, but this article from Vanity Fair is probably one of the best I've ever read on the topic and it will tie all the above that I wrote together. It even sheds a little light on the questions you just asked.
The Lab-Leak Theory: Inside the Fight to Uncover COVID-19’s Origins
And it's conclusion is we still don't know - certainly nothing is 'unequivocal' - and we may never know.
It IS, however a very well done article and lends more credibility to your quest than anything you've put forth so far.
You may want to use it as a guiding light, because some of the other quacks you quote, don't help your cause any.
I'm asking you the same question again, does this look like a cover up to you?
a) Yes
b) No
c) I don't know
A Magician sawing a woman in half LOOKS like someone getting sawed in half - doesn't mean it is.
So there is a MOUNTAIN of evidence - like a freaking MOUNTAIN of NON-POLITCAL evidence (and I didn't even pull out all the stops - there is WAY more where that came from - I just got tired of writing) which is basically a smoking gun with Peter Daszak's finger prints all over it, possibly even making Fauci and Collins look complicit, we had at least one intelligence agency conclude that they believe with 'moderate certainty' it was likely a lab leak, we had the other 4 agencies believe that "zoonotic origin" was of low certainty (again, does that mean they believe with higher certainty that it was a lab leak?) and you want absolute proof to say it might look like a cover up?
Redfield who is a virologist by trade stated it's likely a lab leak, Alina Chan who has been tracking this genetically since day 1 is convinced, Bret Weinstein and many other credible people have ALL gone on record stating that it's MOST LIKELY (like 90% chance) a lab leak from the WIV.
And the most important part is that there is not one shred of credible evidence that it was of zoonotic origin. Not a one.
And you can't even admit that it looks like a cover up.
I had a feeling this was a pointless discussion when you started defending Fauci as though he'd never lied even though he's on film as doing so many times.
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Post by vintagecomics on Jan 31, 2022 21:14:50 GMT -8
Not hardly. People who claim cough syrup cure Co-Vid19 keep muddying the waters.
I'm going to point out one more thing.
You're constantly deflecting. You've used this deflection above 3 or 4 times. I even entertained it and explained to you HOW certain antiseptics CAN work and why they work with oil based proteins.
You just keep returning with the same deflections.
Time will tell. I'm putting my chips on my bet and I'm certain that history won't be kind to the people on the other side of the table.
I've already been more or less right on everything else I argued with people on. I don't think this will be any different.
We can revisit when things are more clear and the dust settles.
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Post by Prince Namor on Feb 1, 2022 5:51:19 GMT -8
So there is a MOUNTAIN of evidence - like a freaking MOUNTAIN of NON-POLITCAL evidence (and I didn't even pull out all the stops - there is WAY more where that came from - I just got tired of writing) which is basically a smoking gun with Peter Daszak's finger prints all over it, possibly even making Fauci and Collins look complicit, we had at least one intelligence agency conclude that they believe with 'moderate certainty' it was likely a lab leak, we had the other 4 agencies believe that "zoonotic origin" was of low certainty (again, does that mean they believe with higher certainty that it was a lab leak?) and you want absolute proof to say it might look like a cover up?
Redfield who is a virologist by trade stated it's likely a lab leak, Alina Chan who has been tracking this genetically since day 1 is convinced, Bret Weinstein and many other credible people have ALL gone on record stating that it's MOST LIKELY (like 90% chance) a lab leak from the WIV.
And the most important part is that there is not one shred of credible evidence that it was of zoonotic origin. Not a one.
And you can't even admit that it looks like a cover up.
I had a feeling this was a pointless discussion
It's a pointless discussion because you can't answer the basic guideline of research or Inquiry: Who, what, why and How.
when you started defending Fauci as though he'd never lied even though he's on film as doing so many times.
Well there's plenty of survival goods available on Alex Jones' website for you.
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Post by Prince Namor on Feb 1, 2022 6:14:46 GMT -8
I'm going to point out one more thing.
You're constantly deflecting. You've used this deflection above 3 or 4 times. I even entertained it and explained to you HOW certain antiseptics CAN work and why they work with oil based proteins.
You just keep returning with the same deflections. Yes Roy. In the same way you've dismissed my thoughts as 'Fauci lied', I dismiss yours as mouthwash cures.
I GET Fauci's situation. Information on covid changed rapidly. The mouthwash cure guy is just full of  .
Many of your allies have an underlying agenda. You're not too naive to be unaware of it, yet you don't seem to mind walking hand in hand with them and even making excuses for their stupidity. You want me to take you seriously when you try and justify mouthwash as a cure for covid19. Really?
Time will tell. I'm putting my chips on my bet and I'm certain that history won't be kind to the people on the other side of the table.
Yeah, when the white supremist groups, take out their anger on Asian-Americans (many who aren't even Chinese) because of it, I'll think of how hard many of you fought to stir up the racism in these nut jobs.
I've already been more or less right on everything else I argued with people on. I don't think this will be any different.
We can revisit when things are more clear and the dust settles.
And it obviously doesn't matter how much incorrect, bogus, or manipulative information you reiterate in order to get there does it? For you, like so many others on the Internet today, what YOU WANT is more important than the real truth.
Winning the argument and 'being right' is more important than worrying about little details of who you've sided with and what they're agenda is and what's true.... just so long as you can say 'Aha! See!' Even if it never is proven true or false, it makes your overall goal SEEM more true.
Still waiting on that whistleblower report to become real news.
But it doesn't matter if it becomes news or is even real, see? It's been SAID. It's been put out there. It could be 100% made up - but NOW, someone claiming to be an 'expert' has sent it out over the Internet and had it repeated by Roy and thousands of others and some dumb motherfuckers will think it's TRUE.
Is that the goal Roy? Does the end justify the means?
To get to the truth about anything, you have to be above it. You're right down there in the mud with it. |
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