Post by vintagecomics on Dec 23, 2021 8:10:11 GMT -8
What about the young, spreading it to the old?
I don't pretend to know EVERYTHING but I do remember having this conversation in detail over the last year, and even the most staunch 'pro lockdown, pro aggressive measures' people like namisgr believed that young children posed very little threat to spreading the virus. The reasons we agreed on where that viral load was much smaller, children were much less symptomatic and therefore they didn't spread the disease as easily as adults.
But shouldn't jabbed elderly be protected now anyway?
Hindsight is certainly 20/20, but with the speed with which this spread across the entire planet and the immediate toll it took on hospitals and healthcare, it scared people - government leaders as well. Do I believe they chose the best solution and made the wisest decisions? Probably not.
But entire sports leagues shut down over this. World futbol shut down their leagues. That's billionaires siding with millionaires to NOT make money. Governments didn't FORCE them to shut down. They chose to NOT make money for a period of time based upon what information was available about the virus.
Of course. This topic alone can be discussed for volumes, but the reality seems to be that no matter how hard you lockdown or which measures you take, the net effect is not significant. Remember, I was ALL for locking down for a period to get our bearings and figure out a plan of attack.
But here we are 2 years in, heading into our 4th ridiculous lockdown even though 80+% of the population is now jabbed and Omicron is not even a serious threat by all indications.
I am convinced that politicians were more concerned about optics and keeping their jobs than public safety and chose the path that gave them the most support, and that path was to fill the public with fear and dread and then save them from the 'threat'.
Wait, are you saying the way we did it killed MORE old people than... than what other way?
No, scientists are saying that. Now that we've had time to look back, we are seeing that the damage done may far outweigh the benefits we thought we had.
The 'other way' would have been what Dr. David Katz called 'total harm minimization' and what The Great Barrington Declaration called 'focused protection'.
We knew within a month that this was mainly killing the elderly and those with co-morbidities. We now know that 40% of deaths in the US from Covid are just diabetic people.
There are 1000's of respectable scientists who feel this way and I sided with this group a few months into the pandemic.
I was called a baby killer, a sociopath and other things by guys like tth2 for wanting to protect those who were being harmed by lockdowns.
The lockdowns were really a convenient solution only for the wealthy. A study in LA county showed that 3 times the poor died from Covid than the wealthy.
That's pretty much lockdowns in a nutshell for those who care about the details.
In America... well, I can only speak for America because this is where I was raised, but it's true throughout most of the world... the wealthy and the ruling class could give two chits about the poor. Always has been that way, always will be that way. You're 100% right, they didn't really care.
If we'd limited the paychecks of the politicians the way they did to the working class, we'd not have stayed in lockdowns very long. The politicians used lockdowns to further agendas that have long been in the wings and they did so at the expense of the majority of the population, who suffered the most.
My friends in Thailand... the way their government handled it was even worse... the amount of suicides and poverty and starvation... it's not just here. This was a magnifying glass as to the way masses are NOT looked after by government.
I agree. So what was the answer? How should they have stopped it? How could they have prevented it?
There is a massive disconnect from what the actual SCIENCE is saying what the media was portraying, and politicians used the media, the great censorship of 2020 and 2021 where they censored any opposing views, and people's fears all fueled unreasonable, impracticable measures that DID NOT WORK.
Wow, that's a lot. I know ZERO. I work in a place with at least 40 people who've gotten the vaccine (including myself) and other than a day of work missed for nausea, none of them had severe side effects from the vaccine. I'm NOT saying that's credible evidence of anything, just stating what I've experienced.
The numbers grow weekly for me. I know of SEVERAL people with exactly the same reactions and they live on opposite sides of the continent. Last night I was at a friend's and he told me how one of his lady friends had a severe reaction - near death, blotches all over her skin, organ failure. When I pulled out pics of a friend who had a similar reaction, he couldn't believe it.
Something is NOT right when the world doesn't allow you to talk about pharmaceutical reactions.
I learned about 3 other women last night. That brings my anecdotal total up to roughly 22 people (and remember, several are very close family members that I know first hand).
The censorship should be everyone's FIRST clue that something is wrong.
It's the CGC forum. You can pretty much state any opinion, and someone will disagree with it.
The CGC moderators enabled the
. They accepted namisgr as some sort of credible scientist, and even though we literally caught him editing his posts at times when he was wrong so that he could sound more right, they elevated him to 'fact checker status' unofficially and he seemed to be protected by the moderation team. Him and many of this friends.
The reality is that namisgr does report science in a decent manner, but he's incredibly political and all of his angles were all a one way street. He pushed a liberal agenda throughout the entire pandemic and in hindsight got a lot wrong.
This is exactly what the media did. The mainstream pushed the left's views, censored the right's and that's how we got in this mess.
For the world to function in a balanced manner, you need both the left and right to entangle.
Says who? The latest I read on it was in the Atlantic a couple of weeks ago, and seemed like both sides were at a stalemate in trying to push their view.
If you EVER see an opposition campaign like the one we saw, opposing the lab leak investigation that alone should be proof that something serious is up.
Yes, the quickest put together vaccine in history, administered to the largest test group ever (the whole world) in the shortest amount of time possible led to the most sideways issues (and really bad reactions) than anything we'd previously seen. Makes sense.
You don't believe it saved any lives at all? We would've been better without it?
I'm an advocate for people who have had negative reactions, whose voices are being silenced and censored and who pharmaceutical companies are covering up.
Maddie De Garay is a 12 year old girl who did her part to help the world and took the Pfizer jab.
upon administering the 2nd dose, she had a massive adverse reaction and is now being fed from a tube. Pfizer, the FDA and the CDC as of September refused to even acknowledge her condition. She was listed by Pfizer as having 'abdominal pain' as a reaction.
There are 1000's of people like her, possibly 10,000's around the world.
She has no recourse and Pfizer has no liability.
We are experiencing a human experiment on society with no transparency of the clinical data to the general public and no liability by the pharma companies.
What is happening is horrific and people now want to inject children with this.
Well, in Pfizer's OWN DATA ABOVE, 34 children were inadvertently injected (they were not authorized at this point for children) and 27 out of 34 children had serious adverse reactions.
It's ridiculous and horrific that they now want to inject kids with these experimental drugs when children are more at risk from a car accident than from Covid-19.
And since the jabs DON'T stop transmission I am at a loss for why the push to inject them.
We've seen this before. One of the more controversial and well known instances was the use of AZT to treat Aids patients. We are cattle to the ruling class.
Yes.
Maybe what this is, as much as anything, is a knee-jerk reaction from 'leaders' to do SOMETHING about this unprecedented crisis, and the natural order of those.... societal leaders naturally following the path that was already there - Big Pharma's relationship with government - and it's a big lazy cluster as usual from those who obviously don't have our best interests in mind. Keep it all muddy, play it like you're helping the world, and let your friends rake in the profits. Business as usual. Is that political?
I'm not sure what the specific message it is you're trying to send. Government is corrupt, disorganized, and controlled by big business? No argument from me. Big Pharma is corrupt, completely organized and in bed with the Federal Government? No argument from me.
Is that it? Is that what you're trying to sell me? I'm already there.
If they used science we wouldn't have been in this mess 2 years later.
Explain that.
Listen to credible scientists who have been censored for opposing the narrative.
The 'science' is currently "test for Covid-19, go home and rest, call us if you need an intubator'.
No early treatment or prevention, no alternatives allowed if they differ from the central narrative and no real science.
We can talk about just this aspect of the protocols for a year and not exhaust it.
Being questioned or being censored? Joe Rogan has been loudly pushing unverified treatments for over a year. Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they are censoring you.
I don't pretend to know EVERYTHING but I do remember having this conversation in detail over the last year, and even the most staunch 'pro lockdown, pro aggressive measures' people like namisgr believed that young children posed very little threat to spreading the virus. The reasons we agreed on where that viral load was much smaller, children were much less symptomatic and therefore they didn't spread the disease as easily as adults.
But shouldn't jabbed elderly be protected now anyway?
Hindsight is certainly 20/20, but with the speed with which this spread across the entire planet and the immediate toll it took on hospitals and healthcare, it scared people - government leaders as well. Do I believe they chose the best solution and made the wisest decisions? Probably not.
But entire sports leagues shut down over this. World futbol shut down their leagues. That's billionaires siding with millionaires to NOT make money. Governments didn't FORCE them to shut down. They chose to NOT make money for a period of time based upon what information was available about the virus.
Of course. This topic alone can be discussed for volumes, but the reality seems to be that no matter how hard you lockdown or which measures you take, the net effect is not significant. Remember, I was ALL for locking down for a period to get our bearings and figure out a plan of attack.
But here we are 2 years in, heading into our 4th ridiculous lockdown even though 80+% of the population is now jabbed and Omicron is not even a serious threat by all indications.
I am convinced that politicians were more concerned about optics and keeping their jobs than public safety and chose the path that gave them the most support, and that path was to fill the public with fear and dread and then save them from the 'threat'.
Wait, are you saying the way we did it killed MORE old people than... than what other way?
No, scientists are saying that. Now that we've had time to look back, we are seeing that the damage done may far outweigh the benefits we thought we had.
The 'other way' would have been what Dr. David Katz called 'total harm minimization' and what The Great Barrington Declaration called 'focused protection'.
We knew within a month that this was mainly killing the elderly and those with co-morbidities. We now know that 40% of deaths in the US from Covid are just diabetic people.
Had we put a focused effort on protecting the most vulnerable rather than a random, sweeping protocol that still allowed the virus to circulate freely, we'd probably saved more of those people and done less harm to society over all, because the point is not only to protect people from Covid, it SHOULD HAVE BEEN to protect ALL people from harm.
Like, how did we protect people from abuse (sexual and physical) when we locked those people in with their captors for a year? We know that most reports of abuse happen through school. When we locked down schools, we stopped them from being able to report their abuse through their usual channel. We created a HORRIFIC situation for some people but their voices were silenced by the mainstream and people like the tth2s of the world, who were in their ivory towers secluded from the reality that most people live in.
I was called a baby killer, a sociopath and other things by guys like tth2 for wanting to protect those who were being harmed by lockdowns.
The lockdowns were really a convenient solution only for the wealthy. A study in LA county showed that 3 times the poor died from Covid than the wealthy.
That's pretty much lockdowns in a nutshell for those who care about the details.
In America... well, I can only speak for America because this is where I was raised, but it's true throughout most of the world... the wealthy and the ruling class could give two chits about the poor. Always has been that way, always will be that way. You're 100% right, they didn't really care.
If we'd limited the paychecks of the politicians the way they did to the working class, we'd not have stayed in lockdowns very long. The politicians used lockdowns to further agendas that have long been in the wings and they did so at the expense of the majority of the population, who suffered the most.
My friends in Thailand... the way their government handled it was even worse... the amount of suicides and poverty and starvation... it's not just here. This was a magnifying glass as to the way masses are NOT looked after by government.
Correct. The say one thing in front of the cameras and do something completely different in practice. The politicians have been lying and playing the pied piper during the entire pandemic and destroying people's lives in the process but making it look like they're doing everyone a favor.
This entire pandemic response was due to the media manipulation of information. If people kept their televisions and phones off, it would have gone very differently and they WOULDN'T have been able to pull off what they did, but the fear tickers on CNN of rising deaths and infections kept people paralyzed and this allowed politicians to push through anything they wanted with little resistance.
I agree. So what was the answer? How should they have stopped it? How could they have prevented it?
Well, I think the real culprit was the media. People bought what was on the news. Even our smart boardies bought it.
Wow, that's a lot. I know ZERO. I work in a place with at least 40 people who've gotten the vaccine (including myself) and other than a day of work missed for nausea, none of them had severe side effects from the vaccine. I'm NOT saying that's credible evidence of anything, just stating what I've experienced.
The numbers grow weekly for me. I know of SEVERAL people with exactly the same reactions and they live on opposite sides of the continent. Last night I was at a friend's and he told me how one of his lady friends had a severe reaction - near death, blotches all over her skin, organ failure. When I pulled out pics of a friend who had a similar reaction, he couldn't believe it.
Something is NOT right when the world doesn't allow you to talk about pharmaceutical reactions.
I learned about 3 other women last night. That brings my anecdotal total up to roughly 22 people (and remember, several are very close family members that I know first hand).
The censorship should be everyone's FIRST clue that something is wrong.
It's the CGC forum. You can pretty much state any opinion, and someone will disagree with it.
The CGC moderators enabled the
. They accepted namisgr as some sort of credible scientist, and even though we literally caught him editing his posts at times when he was wrong so that he could sound more right, they elevated him to 'fact checker status' unofficially and he seemed to be protected by the moderation team. Him and many of this friends.The reality is that namisgr does report science in a decent manner, but he's incredibly political and all of his angles were all a one way street. He pushed a liberal agenda throughout the entire pandemic and in hindsight got a lot wrong.
This is exactly what the media did. The mainstream pushed the left's views, censored the right's and that's how we got in this mess.
For the world to function in a balanced manner, you need both the left and right to entangle.
Says who? The latest I read on it was in the Atlantic a couple of weeks ago, and seemed like both sides were at a stalemate in trying to push their view.
The Lab-Leak Theory Meets Its Perfect Match
That's what they would have you believe. There is literally not ONE piece of evidence that links Covid-19 to an intermediary animal.
On the lab leak side, there is a MASSIVE wall of circumstantial evidence, including China and the WIV destroying documents, the WIV getting a complete makeover AFTER the pandemic started, missing genetic sequences, Peter Daszak (a now shamed and discredited scientist) working overtime to try to obfuscate the investigation, opinions of many world class scientists who believe it was a lab leak, the behavior of the virus itself, and most important of all, the MASSIVE amount of censorship preventing people from discussing the lab leak theory.
Yes, the quickest put together vaccine in history, administered to the largest test group ever (the whole world) in the shortest amount of time possible led to the most sideways issues (and really bad reactions) than anything we'd previously seen. Makes sense.
You don't believe it saved any lives at all? We would've been better without it?
Why would you put those words in my mouth? I never said that. Now you sound like some Chinese 'bot just trying to keep the conversation going when you're running on empty for actual things to talk about. 
Maddie De Garay is a 12 year old girl who did her part to help the world and took the Pfizer jab.
upon administering the 2nd dose, she had a massive adverse reaction and is now being fed from a tube. Pfizer, the FDA and the CDC as of September refused to even acknowledge her condition. She was listed by Pfizer as having 'abdominal pain' as a reaction.
There are 1000's of people like her, possibly 10,000's around the world.
She has no recourse and Pfizer has no liability.
We are experiencing a human experiment on society with no transparency of the clinical data to the general public and no liability by the pharma companies.
What is happening is horrific and people now want to inject children with this.
Well, in Pfizer's OWN DATA ABOVE, 34 children were inadvertently injected (they were not authorized at this point for children) and 27 out of 34 children had serious adverse reactions.
It's ridiculous and horrific that they now want to inject kids with these experimental drugs when children are more at risk from a car accident than from Covid-19.
And since the jabs DON'T stop transmission I am at a loss for why the push to inject them.
We've seen this before. One of the more controversial and well known instances was the use of AZT to treat Aids patients. We are cattle to the ruling class.
Yes.
Maybe what this is, as much as anything, is a knee-jerk reaction from 'leaders' to do SOMETHING about this unprecedented crisis, and the natural order of those.... societal leaders naturally following the path that was already there - Big Pharma's relationship with government - and it's a big lazy cluster
as usual from those who obviously don't have our best interests in mind. Keep it all muddy, play it like you're helping the world, and let your friends rake in the profits. Business as usual. Is that political?I'm not sure what the specific message it is you're trying to send. Government is corrupt, disorganized, and controlled by big business? No argument from me. Big Pharma is corrupt, completely organized and in bed with the Federal Government? No argument from me.
Is that it? Is that what you're trying to sell me? I'm already there.
The ONE key thing to remember is even though they kept saying to 'follow the science' they did no such thing. They followed the optics, the pandering, the virtue signalling, the money and the fear control.
If they used science we wouldn't have been in this mess 2 years later.
Explain that.
Listen to credible scientists who have been censored for opposing the narrative.
The 'science' is currently "test for Covid-19, go home and rest, call us if you need an intubator'.
No early treatment or prevention, no alternatives allowed if they differ from the central narrative and no real science.
We can talk about just this aspect of the protocols for a year and not exhaust it.
Being questioned or being censored? Joe Rogan has been loudly pushing unverified treatments for over a year. Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they are censoring you.
Now you're being silly.
I'm talking about real censorship not having my feelings hurt. Facebook and the media completely censored any discussion about the lab leak theory until recently. They also censored any discussion about adverse vaccine reactions. Now they've flipped on both and are allowing the discussion. Why do you think they flipped? ;-)
Joe rogan is not a doctor. He isn't pushing anything. Rogan puts credible guests on his podcast to get opinions out into the mainstream, and he has been MUCH more careful with his fact checking now that he's on spotify as he doesn't want to get booted.
There are 1000's of doctors and scientists out there that disagree with the censorship and MSM narrative and he just gives those guests a platform. Nothing more.
The fact that highly credible doctors like Peter McCollough are all of a sudden called quacks should make anyone's ears perk up.
The dude is the most published cardio specialist in the world. IN THE WORLD.
Apparently, he's got over 400 papers published just on cardio and another 200 on Covid. He graduated from the top of his class in the best schools in the country.
And now that he's opposed the MSM and appeared on Rogan he's a quack?
Yeah, he was a secret quack for 30 years and now they've finally exposed him. 
Bullocks.
